User talk:Incall

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, please see our help pages, and if you can't find what you are looking for there, please feel free to ask me on my talk page or place {{Help me}} on this page and someone will drop by to help. Again, welcome! Randykitty (talk) 11:10, 16 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding battle of Orbulaq

Hi! I see you reverted my change regarding, source, could you please elaborate on this change? Previous source didn't have any information about given numbers, so I corrected it YerzhanU (talk) 14:47, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The source you put is weak and cannot use wikipedia. There was a source from the book you are removing, this is not allowed in wikipedia. Incall ^talk 08:24, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

the book does not have information it's cited, it's irrelevant 143.58.246.7 (talk) 13:20, 27 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You haven't even read it. Incall ^talk 18:18, 27 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I downloaded and read it, it doesn’t have any mentions of battle of Orbulaq, nor anything that happened in 1643, including numbers that are derived from there YerzhanU (talk) 19:36, 27 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Pages with Altai IPA

A tag has been placed on Category:Pages with Altai IPA indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:45, 7 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding Oirats

Hey there. Regarding your recent deletion of my edits on the Oirats page, I would like to clarify my edits.

The Tubalar people are not a tribe of the Oirats. As per estimate on number people of Oirat origin in Kazakhstan, the Tolengit tribe traces their origins to the Oirats, among the peoples of the tribe Khonyrat in Kazakhstan. As per Tajikistan, the Khongirad were listed as distinct ethnic groups in 2010 and 2020 to my knowledge. As per estimate in Karakalpakstan, some of the Khongirad migrated there and became governors of Khwarazm. There is still a Khongirad clan in the area.

I hope this clears up the confusion. Vofa (talk) 09:15, 12 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. Where do 160,000 Oirats come from in Kyrgyzstan? Origin or any tribe does not make it a nation. If you want the number of people in a country, then take sources from official websites (e.g. stat.gov.kg or stat.gov.kz). Incall ^talk 09:28, 12 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Battle of orbulaq

Hey, I noticed that you’ve been removing a lot of content related to the Battle of Orbulaq. I’m not sure which nation you’re from, but Wikipedia is a platform for individual contributors, and we strive to keep it neutral and factual rather than influenced by nationalistic views. Can you please stop making edits based on bias and instead discuss changes on the talk page? Ambatuhistorypremium (talk) 13:19, 25 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

And tells me it's someone who's only recently registered. Incall ^talk 17:33, 25 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Xueyantuo

I think you're Kyrgyz, cause this edit. You change the map of Kyrgyz khaganate which they likely never ruled tarim basin but you change and use the bigger map for the Kyrgyz khaganate but for other Turkic empires you make small map like Kimek–Kipchak(which they definitely reach Caspian sea and even forced oghuz Turks migrated and took some of their land but you make their territory smaller). Don't make this. Thanks 2A01:5EC0:1006:FE02:1:0:F180:B9BD (talk) 08:21, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Per Michael Drompp

The Khitan ruler Abaoji did extend his influence onto the Mongolian Plateau in 924, but there is no indication whatsoever of any conflict with the Kyrgyz. The only information we have from Khitan (Liao) sources regarding the Kyrgyz indicates that the two powers maintained diplomatic relations. Scholars who write of a Kyrgyz "empire" from about 840 to about 924 are describing a fantasy. All available evidence suggests that despite some brief extensions of their power onto the Mongolian Plateau, the Kyrgyz did not maintain a significant political or military presence there after their victories in the 840s. 2A01:5EC0:1006:FE02:1:0:F180:B9BD (talk) 08:25, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Per source Kyrgyz khaganate is likely a fantasy. 2A01:5EC0:1006:FE02:1:0:F180:B9BD (talk) 08:26, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Originally, the map was on a government website on turkish history and so there is no reason to believe it is fiction. Incall ^talk 10:55, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Show me the "government website on turkish history" 2A01:5EC0:1004:BF46:1:0:F35C:11B6 (talk) 11:14, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

This site is not working right now (verify). Incall ^talk 13:02, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Ok then there is no source. But Per Michael Drompp Kyrgyz Khaganate is fantasy (my issue isn't even Kyrgyz). My issue is that you use Kazakh article in Russian language made by ethnic Russian from Kazakhstan for english wiki 5.113.36.248 (talk) 16:35, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

What is the problem with Russian sources, as far as I am concerned Russian sources are more reliable than others. And this atlas was compiled by ethnic Kazakhs, descendants of those Xueyantuo. Is it just me or are you a nationalist? Incall ^talk 17:01, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I do not reduce maps, I only draw it according to sources, for example the map of Uighur Kaganate was enlarged. Incall ^talk 11:01, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

sources you use for Uighur is legit. I can't have problem with it 5.113.36.248 (talk) 17:03, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I am Kyrgyz, but my Toquz Oguz ancestors were part of the Xueyantuo. Incall ^talk 10:57, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Kyrgyz are not Toquz Oguz. They are descendant of Indo-Europeans that mix with Turkic and mongolic tribes. That's why you have High frequency of R1a 5.113.36.248 (talk) 16:38, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

To begin with, the Kyrgyz are a mixture of early Turkic peoples and Moguls. I am a descendant of the Tele people, also I will remind that Tiele is not the same type of people with one haplogroup. Incall ^talk 16:56, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I just want to answer that Kyrgyz are not Toquz Oguz. And about "same type of people with one haplogroup" just said R1a>55% in Kyrgyz. Kyrgyz even are different in mythology with Turks and Mongols. Unlike Turks and Mongols which are descendant of she-wolf Kyrgyz don't 5.113.36.248 (talk) 17:12, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Just let we put Kyrgyz aside ok 5.113.36.248 (talk) 17:13, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I will answer one last time, a couple of Kyrgyz tribes are descendants of Tiele Incall ^talk 18:21, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Let's forget our all talking. And

Look at map you build for kimak kipchak(I change it) and this "At its height, the Kimak Kaganate had 12 nuclear tribes, extending from the Irtysh river and Altai mountains in the east to the Black Sea steppe in the west, into the taiga fringes in the north, and southward into the desert-steppe. After their decline, the Jeti-Su Kimaks retreated back to the upper Irtysh region, and the western Kipchak-Kimaks settled in the North Pontic steppes" even the bigger map is even small and dosen't show territory of kimak kipchak and you make the map even smaller. Read it "At its height, the Kimak Kaganate had 12 nuclear tribes, extending from the Irtysh river and Altai mountains in the east to the Black Sea steppe in the west" black sea steppe is in Ukraine. 5.113.36.248 (talk) 11:14, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

"Ethnic history of the Kimeks and Kypchaks. 4th—14th centuries"

this is same reference you use for Xueyantuo. 5.113.134.206 (talk) 11:17, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

My friend I have no enmity with you. But you just stick with one reference(I don say it's bad it's just not complete). Kimak kipchak per source are stretched from Altai mountains in the east to the Black Sea steppe if you want to make map for it you must consider that.

This includes not kimak kipchak but also Xueyantuo. 5.113.134.206 (talk) 11:21, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Good luck 5.113.134.206 (talk) 11:22, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Source and pages on them, or the edit will be cancelled within two days and the article will be defended. Incall ^talk 11:30, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Kimball L., "The Vanished Kimak Empire", Western Washington U., 1994, pp.371–373

At its height, the Kimak Kaganate had 12 nuclear tribes, extending from the Irtysh river and Altai mountains in the east to the Black Sea steppe XueyantuoXueyantuo (talk) 11:33, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Source and page and quote XueyantuoXueyantuo (talk) 11:34, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Is there more, not just from one book? Incall ^talk 11:35, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Per wikipedia

English-language sources are preferred over non-English ones when they are available and of equal quality and relevance XueyantuoXueyantuo (talk) 11:40, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

According to Chinese annals, by this point, Zhenzhu Khan's(Khan of Xueyantuo) territory stretched from the Mohe to the east, Western Turks to the west, and Gobi Desert to the south, and that many tribes, including Huige (回纥), Bayegu (拔也古), Adie (阿跌), Tongluo (同羅), Pugu (僕骨), and Baixi (白霫), all submitted to him. He established his power base in Ötüken, traditional capital of Turks. XueyantuoXueyantuo (talk) 11:40, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

previous map was better for Xueyantuo XueyantuoXueyantuo (talk) 11:44, 19 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Xueyantuo map

Do you read this: Zhenzhu Khan's(Khan of Xueyantuo) territory stretched from the Mohe to the east, Western Turks to the west, and Gobi Desert to the south, and that many tribes, including Huige (回纥), Bayegu (拔也古), Adie (阿跌), Tongluo (同羅), Pugu (僕骨), and Baixi (白霫), all submitted to him. "Strategy and Contingency in the Tang Defeat of the Eastern Turks, 629-630". Please change the map XueyantuoXueyantuo (talk) 21:46, 20 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]